I have been mocked, verbally assaulted, called all kinds of names and harassed. Usually it's because they make some kind of assumption about me or what I believe... and almost every time it's NOT true. One thing is that they ALWAYS assume I have not researched this issue. Um yes I have. Both sides too. You want to know my research? Alright, I'll do it this way.... Here are things they typically argue with my response:
- Circumcision is not a parental rights issue. His body His choice.
This IS a Parental Rights issue. Don’t tell me that
it’s an individual rights only and should be left up to the child, because 1)
by not circ’ing you are making a decision that can affect them in the
future, and 2) as a parent you make personal, medical, health and other
decisions for your child all the time. His body, His
choice doesn’t apply when it comes to other health and parenting choices. You
decide what kind of food he’ll eat and how he’ll be raised. You decide how to
treat him when they get sick and what medicine or medical interventions to use.
You decide what education he receives and monitor what he reads and watches. Even
when he gets older you continue to make a lot of decisions for him; you are
careful who your kids hang out with and where they go and what time they should
be home. Sorry, but to argue a parent shouldn’t circ for this reason is
hypocritical.
But, what if your son resents you for this when he grows up?
God forbid! Largely, it seems to me that men resent their circumcision because
a woman makes him feel bad about it. Which is why I largely left this
decision regarding our son up to my husband. However, I should hope that as my
husband and I build a strong relationship with our son he will know that
whatever we did for him was because we loved him and believed it was best for
him. If a child resents his parents for doing their best, then that is his/her
problem not theirs. Parents do need to be open to where they might have
failed their children or been wrong, but also should not beat themselves up or
feel guilty for seeking to do what they believed was best. Parenting is
messy no matter what. There is grace in the mess.
- The Bible is not relevant to the discussion.
It is very relevant unless of course you don’t believe it. In
the Bible, God commanded the Israelites to circumcise all their male children
on the 8th day (8th day because that’s when vitamin K
levels peak and so the ideal time to do it). While I believe the OT law is no
longer valid today (in other words, we do not circ “because the law says so”)
the fact that this was something God commanded them to do is something we
should at least take into consideration. Why did God command this? Since He is
a good God, He would not command something that was harmful to the child,
rather God’s commands were very much for the GOOD of the individual and
community. This says to me that God knows that there was a benefit to
circumcision. Some may ask, well why didn’t God just design men that way?
Answer: I don’t really know, but God did and made provisions for a lot of
things that we don’t really understand. But I know this: God would never
command people to do something that was harmful. Any God-believing person
who tries to tell me that circumcision is harmful completely loses me. And
I disagree with those who claim that circumcision today is very different from
then and therefore we shouldn’t do it. It CAN be yes if it is not done correctly
which is why as an informed parent you need to make sure you have someone who
knows what they are doing and cares about the process. You can get a
professional like an orthodox Jewish Mohel to do it like they have for thousands
of years. So… there goes that argument.
- The Bible says it’s no longer required. Paul said you shouldn’t circumcise.
I never said it was…. But that does not mean that it can’t
still be an option. Paul’s whole point in the book of Galatians is that circumcision
(or keeping the law) is no longer required as a means of salvation.
We no longer enter the Covenant via circumcision or keeping the law. False
teachers were saying that new converts had to be circumcised in order to
be saved and Paul is condemning that. Paul had Timothy circumcised for cultural
reasons but refused to circumcise Titus (for cultural and theological reasons).
*See Acts 16:3. This would indicate that if someone chose to be circumcised (or
to have their son circumcised since that is the normal practice) for cultural
or health or other reasons it would not be wrong. See this article on why Paul
circumcised Timothy: https://www.ligonier.org/learn/qas/acts-16-paul-encourages-timothy-be-circumcised-the/
- It is cosmetic.
It is NOT “cosmetic”! <insert major eye roll here> That you would suggest it’s about how a man’s
private part looks is bad reasoning at best and at worst utterly creepy. Gross.
Stop thinking about what a man’s parts look like. I should hope we can ALL
agree that the decision about circumcision should not involve how it
looks!!!!
- The way it’s done now is not how they did it under Moses.
There is actual a fair amount of truth to this one. Mainstream
doctors are not trained how to do it properly, there have even been some who
have push circumcision as a way to harm. This is tragic! However, you can find
specialists, like a Jewish Mohel, who’s whole job is to circumcise and to do it
as God commanded. Mainstream doctors usually do not know (or care) about doing
it “right” and as a result there are more risks of something going wrong, too
much skin being removed, and it causing harm. I always advocate for screening
the doctor and making sure it will be done correctly. My son was done by a
doctor that had been doing circumcisions for years and had done hundreds very
successfully. He did a great job plus he gave topical and local anesthesia.
Future sons however I think I will still look for a mohel just to be sure.
- It is traumatic; it’s abusive.
It is NOT “abuse” nor would I agree it itself is traumatic.
It nowhere close to the same as being starved or thrown against a wall or
refused love. To say that it “alters the brain” like true abuse does
minimizes and demeans those who have actually suffered abuse and trauma.
Millions of male babies have been being circumcised for thousands of years and 1)
again, God would not have commanded it if it was harmful, and 2) we’d have a
LOT more evidence and messed up men. Now I am not denying that there have been
doctors who have not done this correctly and have caused some harm (and
as a result trauma) – but comparing it to abuse is extreme at best and blaming
the trauma on circumcision instead of the doctor is not fair – or really
logical. To say that circumcision is traumatic or abusive is outrageous. If
you want to insist that it is…. I want nothing further to do with you.
Now, circumcision can cause pain if proper anesthesia is not used – but
there are also many accounts of babies not having pain at all or being very
bothered by it. Remember that for thousands
of years millions of baby boys had NO pain management… and they shockingly were
just fine! However, in our day and age a well-researched and caring parent should make sure the circ is done with
local numbing at the very least.
Intactivists often say something like "obviously you've never watched a circumcision". Actually, I watched my son’s circumcision. He had numbing cream then
additional local anesthesia. Yes, he screamed – but it was largely because he
was being held down, he was cold, people were touching him and he could
still feel some pulling etc. (It’s like going to the dentist – they numb you,
but you can still feel the vibrations, pushing, etc. Not really painful but still can
be super uncomfortable - for some more than others.) The next 8 hours or so he was very uncomfortable at times –
mostly when I had to change his diaper. I was vigilant and followed all the
instructions for follow-up care carefully. I was thankful I was breastfeeding
too as that was very comforting to him. He was naturally upset because he did not
understand what happened or why he felt uncomfortable. I do remember crying
myself at one point because he was uncomfortable and crying. But I was a new
mom and my hormones were a little crazy, so understandable…. many moms report
being “traumatized” by their son’s circumcision – but it is quite likely that
it is largely due to their emotional state and attachment. I don’t at all want to
dismiss their experience, but you do need to consider the role your emotional/hormonal
state takes in things. (Case in point, I’ve never heard a dad who watched say
the same.) The morning after the procedure my son was back to normal and didn’t
even fuss when I changed him.
- It’s comparable to female mutilation.
It is NOT the same as Female Genital Mutilation (FGM). FGM and male circumcision (MC) involve
different organs with different functions. Mutilation involves the destruction
of a part or a whole to make intentionally hideous or remove function. This
is what FGM does, but MC does not (although you could argue there are some who
do do this which is why it’s important to have it done right by someone who
cares about the process – I am assuming here that the circumcision is done
correctly). MC and FGM remove different amounts of tissue with different
functions and different degrees of physical, psychological, and sexual effect.
Medically speaking, whereas male circumcision does have some scientifically-demonstrated
benefits, FGM has only been demonstrated to cause harm. Psychologically
speaking, any effects of MC on the man and his female partners is dubious at
best, with some research showing benefit and some showing harm. On the other
hand, FGM has only been demonstrated to cause psychological harm to the
woman, her husband and family. Sexually speaking, whereas male circumcision has
no proven effect on or in sexual sensation, function, and satisfaction
for both the man and his female partners, FGM has been demonstrated to cause harm
to both her own and her male partners’ sexual sensation, function, and
satisfaction. In short, there is simply no comparison between MC and FGM. If
you want to insist there is, then well, I guess we’re done talking.
- It is never medically necessary or even beneficial.
I saved this one for last since the response will be
longest. While again I would agree it’s not necessary there are occasions
where it IS necessary to be done for medical reasons such as severe infection or other problems
(so to say “never” is just a little ridiculous). There are also many that would argue that it IS beneficial
to men’s health. Not to mention it's absolutly certain that it's safer to do when the boy is a baby rather than wait. The procedure is much more complicated even if you wait a couple months. Now there are medical studies that can be used to back up BOTH
sides and I honestly don’t think one is necessarily more convincing than the
others, but there are several reasons why I believe circumcision is beneficial
to health:
1. Circumcision has a long history. Circumcision has been
practiced since about 4,000 years ago (or 70,000 years ago evolutionary dating).
See http://www.circinfo.net/history_and_recent_trends.html
for one source on this. Hundreds of different cultures all over the world have practiced
it for thousands of years. Even in primitive times they took the risk and
circumcised. They believed even then that the risk was worth the benefit! But modern
man has finally now figured out that there is no benefit and that it’s
all risk and only harm? Yeah OK.
2. There are hundreds of researched and proven
benefits to circumcision. If you don’t believe me you can start here:
UTI Circumcision Studies:
Summary: Uncircumcised infant boys have approximately 10X higher UTI rate than circumcised boys and about the same (12 mo) or about 10X higher (newborn period) than girls. UTIs in infancy are particularly dangerous, leading to kidney infection, permanent kidney damage, meningitis, and bacteremia/sepsis. Uncircumcised men have about 3X higher UTI rate. UTIs in adults are painful but generally not dangerous, except in the elderly. Antibiotic resistance is an extremely serious problem today, leading researchers to refer to modern times as the “post-antibiotic era” or the “antibiotic apocalypse.” One of the most commonly antibiotic-resistant bacteria is E. coli, which is the most common cause of UTIs in all age groups and both sexes.
Increases UTIs or Periurethral Bacterial Flora
~~No Studies~~
Has No Effect on UTIs or Periurethral Bacterial Flora
~~No Studies~~
Reduces UTIs
[1] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9851381
[2] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16140703
[3] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11772190
[4] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10742321
[5] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9685461
[6] http://www.jpeds.com/article/S0022-3476(96)70423-7/fulltext
[7] from Germany! http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11793114
[8] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8453827 (A 2-part study. First was a cohort study. Second was a meta-analysis; see [MA04] below.)
[9] https://www.researchgate.net/.../21840620_Renal_scarring...
[10] study in ADULT MEN http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1472171
[11] http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/86/3/363
[12] Kashani & Faraday, 1989 (apparently, it’s not online, but it’s cited by [8], [11], and [MA03] on this list, as well as by several literature reviews and opinion pieces)
[13] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2624614
[14] http://dx.doi.org/10.1016/S0022-3476(88)80625-5
[15] http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/.../3/338.abstract...
[16] http://archpedi.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx...
[17] http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/78/1/96
[18] http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/75/5/901
[19] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7070887
Meta-Analyses
[MA01] http://www.jurology.com/.../S0022-5347(12)05623-6/fulltext
[MA02] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18316994
[MA03] http://adc.bmj.com/content/90/8/853.long
[MA04] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8453827
[MA05] https://www.readbyqxmd.com/.../-circumcision-in-the... [Note: This comes from Mexico, a low-circumcising country.]
Reduces Periurethral Bacterial Flora (which reduces UTI risk)
[1] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9563029
[2] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8453827
[3] http://dx.doi.org/10.1016/S0022-3476(88)80625-5
[4] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2902235
[5] http://archpedi.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx...
Summary: Uncircumcised infant boys have approximately 10X higher UTI rate than circumcised boys and about the same (12 mo) or about 10X higher (newborn period) than girls. UTIs in infancy are particularly dangerous, leading to kidney infection, permanent kidney damage, meningitis, and bacteremia/sepsis. Uncircumcised men have about 3X higher UTI rate. UTIs in adults are painful but generally not dangerous, except in the elderly. Antibiotic resistance is an extremely serious problem today, leading researchers to refer to modern times as the “post-antibiotic era” or the “antibiotic apocalypse.” One of the most commonly antibiotic-resistant bacteria is E. coli, which is the most common cause of UTIs in all age groups and both sexes.
Increases UTIs or Periurethral Bacterial Flora
~~No Studies~~
Has No Effect on UTIs or Periurethral Bacterial Flora
~~No Studies~~
Reduces UTIs
[1] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9851381
[2] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16140703
[3] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11772190
[4] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10742321
[5] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9685461
[6] http://www.jpeds.com/article/S0022-3476(96)70423-7/fulltext
[7] from Germany! http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11793114
[8] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8453827 (A 2-part study. First was a cohort study. Second was a meta-analysis; see [MA04] below.)
[9] https://www.researchgate.net/.../21840620_Renal_scarring...
[10] study in ADULT MEN http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1472171
[11] http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/86/3/363
[12] Kashani & Faraday, 1989 (apparently, it’s not online, but it’s cited by [8], [11], and [MA03] on this list, as well as by several literature reviews and opinion pieces)
[13] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2624614
[14] http://dx.doi.org/10.1016/S0022-3476(88)80625-5
[15] http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/.../3/338.abstract...
[16] http://archpedi.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx...
[17] http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/78/1/96
[18] http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/75/5/901
[19] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7070887
Meta-Analyses
[MA01] http://www.jurology.com/.../S0022-5347(12)05623-6/fulltext
[MA02] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18316994
[MA03] http://adc.bmj.com/content/90/8/853.long
[MA04] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8453827
[MA05] https://www.readbyqxmd.com/.../-circumcision-in-the... [Note: This comes from Mexico, a low-circumcising country.]
Reduces Periurethral Bacterial Flora (which reduces UTI risk)
[1] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9563029
[2] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8453827
[3] http://dx.doi.org/10.1016/S0022-3476(88)80625-5
[4] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2902235
[5] http://archpedi.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx...
Also:
Study performed that examined the pain level in circumcision.
This shows that circumcision should ideally be performed the first week of life
in order to be painless. Delaying circumcision also increases risk for bleeding.
https://lookaside.fbsbx.com/file/banieghbal%202009.pdf?token=AWyR39rBRJS8dnzkzDP1pOw05Nz6nhlUCKt59p1SpAMxP5yCjeZppxOFyXgpSZtyE8icQAklWi4R3zp7GlMki6lwDvL_O0ch_JrGSmsl0uk4hkKKswJgnp_e0tDhRYyWc21sodP8tihZ1Q9q8d7wc7H8
You can disagree with me if you like, it’s a free country.
But I hope this helps you understand this perspective a little more. But whatever
you decide, please, don’t be an angry arrogant intactivist. Don’t touch my parental
rights or question my parenting ability or love for my child. Because I will have no patience with
you.
Health and Peace!
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